- PTAB · Nov 29, 2024 · IPR2024-00133 · APJ Scott B Howard · IPR · Remand
On remand, the Board instituted IPR on claims 1–10 and all asserted grounds, finding a reasonable likelihood that claim 1 is obvious over Sturman and Ho.
RulingsRemand decision- RemandOther
“(“Decision Denying Institution” or “DDI”). Petitioner filed a request for Director Review and the Director vacated and remanded our Decision Denying Institution. Paper 11 (Petitioner’s Request for Director Review); Paper 12 (“Remand Dec.” or “Remand Decision”). Specifically, the Director directed that we: shall issue a new decision on institution resolving the claim construction of “a non-promotional background object.” Consistent with Phillips v. AWH Corp., 415 F.3d 1303, 1313–14 (Fed. Cir. 2005), the Board should resolve the proper meaning of that term by first assessing the intrinsic evidence, and then consulting extrinsic evidence if necessary. See, e.g., Samsung Elecs. Co., Ltd. v. Slyde Analytics, LLC, IPR2024-00040, Paper 14 at 7–8 (Vidal Aug. 2, 2024) (discussing the Phillips framework). The Board shall consider all remaining necessary issues, and determine whether to institute trial consistent with this decision. Id. at 7–8 (footnote omitted).” slip op. at 2
- PTAB / AIA Trials › Institution threshold (reasonable likelihood / more likely than not)InstitutedInstituted
“d) Conclusion Regarding Claim 1 Based on the current record, there is a reasonable likelihood that Petitioner will prevail in demonstrating that claim 1 is unpatentable as obvious in view of Sturman and Ho. 4. Analysis of Claims 2–10 Because Petitioner demonstrates a reasonable likelihood of success in proving that at least one claim of the ’089 patent is unpatentable, we institute on all grounds and all claims raised in the Petition. See 37 C.F.R. § 42.108(a). Therefore, at this stage of the proceeding, it is not necessary for us to provide an assessment of every challenge raised by Petitioner, especially, as in this case, when Patent Owner does not separately argue those claims. See Prelim. Resp. 26–36. Those challenges, in our view, are best left for trial after full development of the record.” slip op. at 42
- Claim Construction › Intrinsic evidence (Phillips canons) › Plain and ordinary meaning to a POSITATerm construed board ownOther
“draws a distinction between foreground and background objects. Specifically, the prosecution history makes it clear that foreground objects are “in the forefront of the game play as primary objects to be manipulated or used during game play” and that background objects are “outside the primary focus of game play and as unexpectedly interactive components.” Ex. 1002, 85. However, whether an object is “outside the primary focus of game play and as unexpectedly interactive components” is based solely on the subjective perspective of the user. That is, what one user may consider a primary focus or expected object, another might consider outside the primary focus and unexpected. As the Director made clear in the Remand Decision, it is “improper[]” to have a claim construction “based on the subjective perspective of a user.” Remand Dec. 7; see also Amazon.com, Inc. v. Barnesandnoble.com, Inc., 239 F.3d 1343, 1353 (Fed. Cir. 2001) (“We are not prepared to assign a meaning to a patent claim that depends on the state of mind of the accused infringer.”). Accordingly, we cannot and do not adopt that as our construction of the term background. Not finding a construction of “background” based on the intrinsic evidence, we turn to the extrinsic evidence. See Remand Dec. 7 (“[T]he Board should resolve the proper meaning of that term by first assessing the intrinsic evidence, and then consulting extrinsic evidence if necessary.” (emphasis added)). Specifically, as part of the Decision Denying Institution, we considered various dictionary definitions of the word “background.” According to those definitions, “background” refers to “[t]he part of a pictorial representation that appears to be in the distance and that provides relief for the principal objects in the foreground.” Ex. 3002 (AMERICAN HERITAGE DICTIONARY); see also Ex. 3003 (“the scenery or ground behind something,” “the part of a painting representing what lies behind objects in the foreground”) (MERRIAM-WEBSTER DICTIONARY). Consistent with those dictionary definitions, we construe the term “background” to mean the part of a pictorial representation that is not in the foreground. The prosecution history provides more useful guidance as to what a “non-promotional” object is. As the applicant argued in the Amendment discussed above, a non-promotional object is one “which does not have an ‘area’ in which advertisements directly appear, but instead represents a ‘hot spot’ that, upon activation, causes ‘hidden promotional content’ to then appear.” Ex. 1002, 85–86. In other words, a non-promotional object does not display a promotional message unless the hotspot is activated. This understanding of the meaning of non-promotional is consistent with an earlier argument (Ex. 1002, 113–25) the applicant made during the prosecution of the ’089 patent.12 At that time, the applicant argued: In an exemplary embodiment, the location in-game may be represented by a non-promotional object, such as a blank chalk board depicted in the background of the gaming environment. See Applicant’s Specification at ¶ [0045]. Upon activating the hot spot (e.g., by throwing a dart at the chalk board), a promotional message may be drawn on the chalk board and displayed to the user. See id. In other words, Applicant’s amended claims 15 and 22, inter alia, may present promotional content once the game user activates, unknowingly, a “hot spot” associated with a non-promotional object—the non-promotional object is not an ordinary or visible place for advertisement, the 12 This argument was made on December 2, 2011, which is prior to the amendment adding the term background on July 15, 2013. Compare Ex. 1002, 117 (then pending claim 15 without the word “background”) with id. at 80 (amendment adding “background” to claim 15). user does not know that the object has a hidden hot spot, and the user does not know that activating the hidden “hot spot” will display promotional content. Ex. 1002, 122 (emphasis added).” slip op. at 15
- PTAB / AIA Trials › Discretionary denial › §325(d) same art / argumentsInstitution denied 325dDenied
“Moreover, even if we did consider only the specific references addressed in the Preliminary Response, we would not reach a different outcome. Patent Owner focuses on a high-level comparison of the references. See Prelim. Resp. 13–19. Such high-levels of similarity are to be expected as all of the references involve advertising in computer game programs. But such high-level similarity is not sufficient. See Juniper Networks, Inc. v. Swarm Tech. LLC, IPR2021-01445, Paper 15 at 16 (PTAB March 2, 2022) (Institution Decision) (“The issue is not just whether the same elements can be found in each of the references, but whether the elements function the same way. That is, even though Leong and Bates have the same elements, that does not mean that the elements interact with each other the same way or perform the same functions as recited in the claims.”); see also Advanced Bionics, IPR2019-01469, Paper 6 at 15 (holding that prior art is substantially the same if “Petitioner relies on [the new art] in substantially the same manner as the Examiner cited [the previous art] during prosecution such that [the new art] discloses substantially the same information as [the previous art] in relevant part.”); Nokia of Am. Corp. v. Alexander Soto, IPR2023-00680, Paper 18 at 7 (PTAB Mar. 28, 2024) (Vidal) (determining the Board erred when “rather than identify material, substantive overlap between the arguments presented in the Petitions and those previously presented to the Office, the Board’s analysis relied on its discussion of high-level similarities but lacked detailed reasoning”); Wolfspeed, Inc. v . The Trustees of Purdue University, IPR2022-00761, Paper 13 at 7 (PTAB Mar. 30, 2023) (Vidal) (vacating the Board’s decision when the “analysis of the first part of the Advanced Bionics framework did not consider sufficiently the material differences between” the art the Office previously considered and the art the Petition cited). Nor were any of Petitioner’s Reply arguments improper. We expressly authorized Petitioner to respond to Patent Owner’s arguments that the prior art relied on in the Petition was substantially the same as prior art that was considered. Ex. 3005 (Email from the Board to the parties) (“Petitioner is authorized to file a preliminary reply brief addressing 1) Patent Owner’s arguments under 35 U.S.C. 325(d). . . .”). Moreover, given the facts of this proceeding, it is not reasonable to require Petitioner to anticipate “substantially the same prior art” arguments and address them in the Petition. Accordingly, Petitioner’s argument is a proper reply argument. 3. Conclusion Based on our consideration of Becton Dickinson factors (a), (b), and (d), we find that the same or substantially the same art or arguments were not previously presented to the Office. Thus, our analysis ends at this point, and we need not proceed to part two of the Advanced Bionics framework. See Advanced Bionics, IPR2019-01469, Paper 6 at 8. We therefore decline to exercise our discretion to deny institution based on 35 U.S.C. § 325(d).” slip op. at 25
Claim construction§ 102 anticipation§ 103 obviousnessDiscretionary denialcites Phillips · KSR · GrahamPatents in suitUS 8,688,089 - Google LLC v. Proxense, LLCInstitutedPTAB · Jul 24, 2024 · IPR2024-00232 · APJ David C Mckone · IPR · Institution
Instituted IPR of claims 1–6 and 8–17 based on reasonable likelihood that Google would prevail on the asserted obviousness grounds over Ludtke, alone or with Kon.
RulingsInstitution decision- PTAB / AIA Trials › Institution threshold (reasonable likelihood / more likely than not)InstitutedInstituted
“review. See 35 U.S.C. § 314 (2016); 37 C.F.R. § 42.4(a) (2020). The standard for instituting an inter partes review is set forth in 35 U.S.C. § 314(a), which provides that an inter partes review may not be instituted “unless . . . there is a reasonable likelihood that the petitioner would prevail with respect to at least 1 of the claims challenged in the petition.” For the reasons explained below, we institute an inter partes review of the ’730 patent.” slip op. at 2
- Prior constructionPrior construction adoptedDecided for patent owner
“third-party trusted authority” to exclude any active participant in a transaction. This would exclude the trusted key authority of the preferred embodiments of the ’730 patent, which actively participates in a transaction, for example by receiving a request for authentication with a code, determining whether the code is valid, authenticating the code, and transmitting an access code to the requester, which allows a user access to an application. Ex. 1001, 7:10–22, Fig. 7. Although the trusted key authority in this example is not a principal party to the transaction (here, those parties are the user and the application), it is an active participant in facilitating the transaction. In another preferred embodiment of the ’730 patent, trusted key authority 320 plays an active role in transactions, e.g., verifying to a grocery store that a biometric key presented by a customer is legitimate, thereby allowing the transaction to proceed. Id. at 5:42–56, Figs. 3–4. However, despite the trusted key authority’s active participation, the parties to such a transaction are the customer and the grocery store, not trusted key authority 320. The “witness” role mentioned in the Specification (Ex. 1001, 6:35–38) refers to an agent’s relationship to the principal parties to the transaction, not to the level of activity the agent engages in. See id. at 6:32–64, Fig. 5 (describing activities of an agent). slip op. at 11
- Claim Construction › Threshold & procedure › Whether a term needs construction (O2 Micro)No construction neededDecided for patent owner
“2. Remaining claim terms Based on the preliminary record, we do not find it necessary to provide express claim constructions for any other terms. See Nidec Motor Corp. v. Zhongshan Broad Ocean Motor Co., 868 F.3d 1013, 1017 (Fed. Cir. 2017) (noting that “we need only construe terms ‘that are in controversy, and only to the extent necessary to resolve the controversy’”) (quoting Vivid Techs., Inc. v. Am. Sci. & Eng’g, Inc., 200 F.3d 795, 803 (Fed. Cir. 1999)).” slip op. at 12
- Skill levelSkill level petitioner adoptedDecided for petitioner
“1. Level of skill in the art Petitioner contends that a person of ordinary skill in the art “would have had at least a bachelor’s degree in Computer or Electrical Engineering or an equivalent engineering discipline, and at least three years of experience in the field of encryption and security, or the equivalent,” and that “[a]dditional education could substitute for professional experience, and significant work experience could substitute for formal education.” Pet. 5 (citing Ex. 1003 ¶¶ 31–32, 54–56). Patent Owner does not challenge Petitioner’s proposed level of skill or propose an alternative. Petitioner’s proposal is consistent with the technology described in the Specification and the cited prior art. For purposes of this Decision, we adopt Petitioner’s proposed level of skill.” slip op. at 13
Claim construction§ 103 obviousnessDiscretionary denialcites GrahamPatents in suitUS 8,352,730 - Google LLC v. Proxense, LLCInstitutedPTAB · Jul 23, 2024 · IPR2024-00234 · APJ Kevin F Turner · IPR · Institution
The Board instituted IPR on claims 1–7 and 9–18 based on the asserted obviousness grounds over Ludtke and Ludtke with Kon.
RulingsInstitution decision- Prior constructionPrior construction adoptedDecided for petitioner
“The Samsung DDI does not provide a basis for further limiting a “third-party trusted authority” to exclude any active participant in a transaction. This would exclude the trusted key authority of the preferred embodiments of the ’730 patent, which actively participates in a transaction, for example by receiving a request for authentication with a code, determining whether the code is valid, authenticating the code, and transmitting an access code to the requester, which allows a user access to an application. Ex. 1001, 8:8–20, Fig. 7. Although the trusted key authority in this example is not a principal party to the transaction (here, the parties are the user and the application), it is an active participant in facilitating the transaction. In another preferred embodiment of the ’905 Patent, trusted key authority 320 plays an active role in transactions, e.g., verifying to a grocery store that a biometric key presented by a customer is legitimate, thereby allowing the transaction to proceed. Id. at 6:39–53, Figs. 3–4. However, despite trusted key authority’s active participation, the parties to such a transaction are the customer and the grocery store, not trusted key authority 320. The “witness” role mentioned in the Specification (Ex. 1001, 7:33–36) refers to an agent’s relationship to the principal parties to the transaction, not to level of activity the agent engages in. See id. at 7:30–642, Fig. 5 (describing activities of an agent). Patent Owner’s proposed clarifications, or modifications, to the Samsung DDI’s construction of “third-party trusted authority,” which would exclude these embodiments, is presumptively incorrect. See Sequoia Tech., LLC v. Dell, Inc., 66 F.4th 1317, 1327 (Fed. Cir. 2023) (“The Federal Circuit “recognize[s] that ‘[a] claim construction exclud[ing] a preferred embodiment is rarely, if ever correct.’” (quoting Kaufman v. Microsoft Corp., 34 F.4th 1360, 1372 (Fed. Cir. 2022) (second and third alterations in original)). Indeed, Patent Owner’s view would transform any entity that is accessed for any reason in a transaction into a party to that transaction, thus excluding it from the scope of a “third-party trusted authority.” Patent Owner, however, has advanced no persuasive support for such a narrow reading of the claims. Accordingly, we adopt the Samsung DDI’s construction without Patent Owner’s modifications. On the current record, a “third-party trusted authority” is “a trusted authority that is an entity separate from the parties to a transaction.”” slip op. at 10
- Claim Construction › Threshold & procedure › Whether a term needs construction (O2 Micro)No construction neededOther
“2. Remaining claim terms Based on the preliminary record, we do not find it necessary to provide express claim constructions for any other terms. See Nidec Motor Corp. v. Zhongshan Broad Ocean Motor Co., 868 F.3d 1013, 1017 (Fed. Cir. 2017) (noting that “we need only construe terms ‘that are in controversy, and only to the extent necessary to resolve the controversy’”) (quoting Vivid Techs., Inc. v. Am. Sci. & Eng’g, Inc., 200 F.3d 795, 803 (Fed. Cir. 1999)).” slip op. at 11
- Skill levelSkill level petitioner adoptedDecided for petitioner
“Petitioner contends that a person of ordinary skill in the art “would have had at least a bachelor’s degree in Computer or Electrical Engineering or an equivalent engineering discipline, and at least three years of experience in the field of encryption and security, or the equivalent,” and that “[a]dditional education could substitute for professional experience, and significant work experience could substitute for formal education.” Pet. 4–5 (citing Ex. 1003 ¶¶ 31–32, 54–56). Patent Owner does not challenge Petitioner’s proposed level of skill or propose an alternative. See Prelim. Resp. Based on the record presented, including our review of the ’905 Patent and the types of problems and solutions described in the ’905 Patent and cited prior art, we adopt Petitioner’s definition of the level of ordinary skill in the art and apply it for purposes of this Decision.” slip op. at 13
- Obviousness (§103) › Motivation to combine / reasonable expectation of successMotivation foundInstituted
“Petitioner contends that Kon describes registering and storing a user’s age in association with a user device’s device ID. Pet. 43–46 (citing Ex. 1006 ¶¶ 194, 234, 241, 264–265, Figs. 5, 9; Ex. 1003 ¶¶ 66–70). Petitioner argues that “[t]he user’s age, like the biometric information, provides another data point for identifying the user,” and would have been especially useful when a transaction has an age minimum, such as purchasing alcohol or cigarettes. Id. at 50 (citing Ex. 1003 ¶¶ 152–153). Accordingly, Petitioner argues, a skilled artisan would have registered a user’s age, as taught by Kon, with Ludtke’s device ID to facilitate age-prohibitive transactions. Id. Petitioner makes the same arguments for claim 11. Id. at 51 (citing Ex. 1003 ¶ 155). Patent Owner does not yet provide separate arguments for claims 2 and 11. See Prelim. Resp. On the current record, Petitioner has shown sufficiently that Kon teaches the additional limitations of claims 2 and 11, and that a skilled artisan would have had reasons, with rational underpinning, for combining Ludtke and Kon.” slip op. at 26
Claim construction§ 103 obviousnessDiscretionary denialcites KSR · GrahamPatents in suitUS 9,298,905 - PTAB · May 10, 2024 · IPR2024-00209 · APJ Scott B Howard · IPR · Institution
The Board instituted IPR on claims 1–20 on all asserted grounds, finding a reasonable likelihood that PLR would prevail on at least one claim.
RulingsInstitution decision- PTAB / AIA Trials › Institution threshold (reasonable likelihood / more likely than not)InstitutedInstituted
“determine whether to institute an inter partes review under 35 U.S.C. § 314 and 37 C.F.R. § 42.4(a). Inter partes review may not be instituted unless “the information presented in the petition filed under [35 U.S.C.] section 311 and any response filed under [35 U.S.C.] section 313 shows that there is a reasonable likelihood that the petitioner would prevail with respect to at least 1 of the claims challenged in the petition.” 35 U.S.C. § 314(a) (2018). “When instituting inter partes review, the Board will authorize the review to proceed on all of the challenged claims and on all grounds of unpatentability asserted for each claim.” 37 C.F.R. § 42.108(a) (2023).” slip op. at 2
- PTAB / AIA Trials › Discretionary denial › §325(d) same art / argumentsInstitution denied 325dDenied
“focuses on a high-level comparison of the references. See Prelim. Resp. 14– 19. Such high-levels of similarity are to be expected as all of the references involve advertising in computer game programs. But such high-level similarity is not sufficient. Instead, Patent Owner must demonstrate that the references relied on in the Petition are substantially the same in all material respects to the prior art the Examiner actually relied on. See Juniper Networks, Inc. v. Swarm Tech. LLC, IPR2021-01445, Paper 15 at 16 (PTAB March 2, 2022) (Institution Decision) (“The issue is not just whether the same elements can be found in each of the references, but whether the elements function the same way. That is, even though Leong and Bates have the same elements, that does not mean that the elements interact with each other the same way or perform the same functions as recited in the claims.”); see also Advanced Bionics, IPR2019-01469, Paper 6 at 15 (holding that prior art is substantially the same if “Petitioner relies on [the new art] in substantially the same manner as the Examiner cited [the previous art] during prosecution such that [the new art] discloses substantially the same information as [the previous art] in relevant part.”).” slip op. at 16
- Novelty / Anticipation (§102) › Prior-art status of a reference › Printed publication / public accessibilityPrinted publication establishedReference is prior artDecided for petitioner
“We disagree with Patent Owner’s statutory interpretation. Ho is a printed publication, having been published in January 2008, as Patent Owner acknowledges. See Ex. 1004, code (43) (publication date of January 17, 2008); see also Prelim. Resp. 45 (acknowledging publication date). On this record, we are persuaded by Petitioner’s contentions that Ho is prior art under 35 U.S.C. § 102(e), having been filed “by another . . . in the United States before the invention by the applicant for patent.”11 See Pet. 7 (“For purposes of this Petition, Petitioner uses a June 26, 2007 priority date” for the ’662 patent); see also Ex. 1004, code (22) (filing date of July 12, 2006). Thus, Petitioner asserts a permissible ground of unpatentability” slip op. at 21
- Obviousness (§103) › Motivation to combine / reasonable expectation of successInstituted
“claim 115 and that a person having ordinary skill in the art would combine the relevant teachings of Ho and Aoki. See Pet. 17–26, 30. With the exception of “hot spot” and “hot spot information,” which we discussed above in Section II.G.3(a), at the present time Patent Owner does not dispute that Ho teaches those limitations. See Prelim. Resp. 26–35. After reviewing Petitioner’s arguments and information regarding the limitations identified above, including the Zagal Declaration, we are persuaded that Petitioner sufficiently demonstrates, for purposes of this Decision, that Ho teaches limitations 1(pre), 1(a), (1)(b)(1), 1(d), and 1(e) and that a person having” slip op. at 39
Claim construction§ 102 anticipation§ 103 obviousnessDiscretionary denialcites Phillips · KSR · GrahamPatents in suitUS 9,427,662 - PTAB · Mar 22, 2024 · IPR2023-01294 · APJ Michael J Fitzpatrick · IPR · Institution
The Board instituted IPR on claims 1–20 over all asserted grounds, finding a reasonable likelihood of success on claims 1, 11, and 16 under the Downs/EDACS and Kim grounds.
RulingsInstitution decision- PTAB / AIA Trials › Discretionary denial › Fintiv (parallel litigation)Denied
“A. Discretion Under 35 U.S.C. § 314 Patent Owner argues that we should exercise our discretion under 35 U.S.C. § 314(a) and deny the Petition in view of the related lawsuit in the Eastern District of Texas. Prelim. Resp. 25 (citing Apple Inc. v. Fintiv, Inc., No. IPR2020-00019, Paper 11 at 5–6 (PTAB Mar. 20, 2020) (precedential) (“Fintiv”); Interim Procedure for Discretionary Denials in AIA Post-Grant Proceedings with Parallel District Court Litigation (June 21, 2022) (“Interim Procedure”)). However, Petitioner has since filed a Sotera stipulation, so named based on Sotera Wireless, Inc. v. Masimo Corp., IPR2020-01019, Paper 12 (PTAB Dec. 1, 2020) (precedential as to § II.A). See Ex. 1035. Thus, pursuant to the Interim Procedure, we will not discretionarily deny the Petition based on the related lawsuit. See Interim Procedure at 3 (“Consistent with Sotera Wireless, Inc., the PTAB will not discretionarily deny institution in view of parallel district court litigation where a petitioner presents a stipulation not to pursue in a parallel proceeding the same grounds or any grounds that could have reasonably been raised before the PTAB.”).” slip op. at 10
- PTAB / AIA Trials › Discretionary denial › §325(d) same art / argumentsDenied
“In assessing whether to exercise the Board’s authority to deny institution under § 325(d), the Board considers a two-part analysis. Advanced Bionics, LLC v. Med-El Elektromedizinische Geräte GmbH, No. IPR2019-01469, Paper 6 at 8–9 (Feb. 13, 2020) (precedential). First, in Part One, the Board considers whether “the same or substantially the same” art or arguments were previously presented to the Office. Id. at 8. If so, in Part Two, the Board then considers whether the petition demonstrates that the Office “erred in a manner material to the patentability of the challenged claims.” Id. In applying the two-part framework, the Board considers several nonexclusive factors set forth in Becton, Dickinson & Co. v. B. Braun Melsungen AG, No. IPR2017-01586, Paper 8 at 17–18 (PTAB Dec. 15, 2017) (precedential as to § III.C.5, first paragraph).” slip op. at 11
- PTAB / AIA Trials › Institution threshold (reasonable likelihood / more likely than not)InstitutedInstituted
“status of a channel,” “having or collecting information on ongoing communications,” and “providing call access to entities” does not constitute “monitoring media streams,” as recited in claims 1, 11, and 16. See Prelim. Resp. 10–11 (citing Pet. 29). Patent Owner does not, however, propose a construction for “monitoring media streams,” let alone one that might elucidate the distinction Patent Owner is advancing. Nor is such a distinction apparent based on the claim language. For example, the plain and ordinary meaning of “monitoring media streams” appears to encompass, among other things, Down’s disclosure that “[t]he dispatcher console is informed of the individual transmitters and channels that are being used and of the status of other transmitters and receivers in the system.” Ex. 1004, 2:20–22; see also id. at 3:17–26 (explaining that the display provides caller, volume, and, if applicable, emergency status of each individual communication). The plain and ordinary meaning of “monitoring media streams” appears to also encompass EDACS’s disclosure that its “system receives [an emergency] request and assigns the emergency call to a free channel.” Ex. 1005, 25.” slip op. at 15
- Claim Construction › Threshold & procedure › Whether a term needs construction (O2 Micro)Plain and ordinary meaningOther
“status of a channel,” “having or collecting information on ongoing communications,” and “providing call access to entities” does not constitute “monitoring media streams,” as recited in claims 1, 11, and 16. See Prelim. Resp. 10–11 (citing Pet. 29). Patent Owner does not, however, propose a construction for “monitoring media streams,” let alone one that might elucidate the distinction Patent Owner is advancing. Nor is such a distinction apparent based on the claim language. For example, the plain and ordinary meaning of “monitoring media streams” appears to encompass, among other things, Down’s disclosure that “[t]he dispatcher console is informed of the individual transmitters and channels that are being used and of the status of other transmitters and receivers in the system.” Ex. 1004, 2:20–22; see also id. at 3:17–26 (explaining that the display provides caller, volume, and, if applicable, emergency status of each individual communication). The plain and ordinary meaning of “monitoring media streams” appears to also encompass EDACS’s disclosure that its “system receives [an emergency] request and assigns the emergency call to a free channel.” Ex. 1005, 25.” slip op. at 15
Claim construction§ 103 obviousnessDiscretionary denialcites KSR · GrahamPatents in suitUS 8,831,664 - PTAB · Mar 21, 2024 · IPR2023-01295 · APJ Kevin C Trock · IPR · Institution
The Board instituted IPR on claims 1–5, 7–19, and 21–24 on both § 103 grounds: Shaffer with Saylor, and Gogic with Opitz.
RulingsInstitution decision- PTAB / AIA Trials › Discretionary denial › §325(d) same art / argumentsDenied
“We disagree with Patent Owner’s characterization of the prosecution history. After the Examiner issued a final rejection of then-pending claim 1 (Ex. 1003, 125–138), Applicant amended claim 1 by adding the following limitations:” slip op. at 12
- PTAB / AIA Trials › Discretionary denial › Fintiv (parallel litigation)Denied
“informing the Board of the stipulation Petitioner made to Patent Owner on December 27, 2023. Paper 8, 5 (citing Ex. 1034). The Stipulation reads: Motorola Solutions, Inc. stipulates that, if the Patent Trial and Appeal Board institutes an IPR proceeding for U.S. Patent No. 8,994,830 on the grounds presented in the petition in IPR2023- 01295, Motorola Solutions, Inc. will not pursue an invalidity defense in the district court action (STA Group LLC v. Motorola Solutions, Inc., Case No. 2:22-cv-00381 (E.D. Tex.)) that the patent claims subject to the instituted IPR are invalid based on grounds that were raised or reasonably could have been raised in the IPR. Id. Petitioner has filed a stipulation that it “will not pursue an invalidity defense in the district court action (STA Group LLC v. Motorola Solutions, Inc., Case No. 2:22-cv-00381 (E.D. Tex.)) that the patent claims subject to the instituted IPR are invalid based on grounds that were raised or reasonably could have been raised in the IPR.” Ex. 1034. Petitioner contends that its “Sotera stipulation moots Patent Owner’s (‘PO’) Fintiv arguments.” Prelim. Repl. 1 (citing Ex. 1034; Ex. 1032, 3). Patent Owner does not respond, in the Preliminary Sur-reply, to Petitioner’s Reply argument regarding discretionary denial or argue that we nevertheless should deny the Petition in light of Petitioner’s stipulation. See, generally, Prelim. Sur-Reply. Upon consideration of these factors and the parties’ arguments, we decline to exercise our discretion to deny the Petition in light of Petitioner’s Sotera stipulation. See Guidance Memo 7.” slip op. at 16
- PTAB / AIA Trials › Institution threshold (reasonable likelihood / more likely than not)InstitutedInstituted
“d. Conclusion as to Independent Claim 1 We have considered all of the evidence and arguments presented by the parties with respect to independent claim 1. Based on the record before us, we are persuaded that Petitioner has demonstrated sufficiently for purposes of institution that the combined teachings of Shaffer and Saylor meet all the limitations of independent claim 1 and that a person of ordinary skill in the art at the time of the claimed invention would have had reason to combine their teachings in the manner described, and would have had a reasonable expectation of success in so doing.” slip op. at 53
- Skill levelSkill level petitioner adoptedDecided for petitioner
“Petitioner describes a person of ordinary skill in the art as a person having “at least (a) a bachelor’s degree in computer science, electrical engineering, or a similar field, and (b) approximately 2 years industry experience in networking or communication systems, including interoperating different types of networks that include video feeds.” Pet. 13 (citing Ex. 1002 ¶¶ 45–47). Patent Owner does not dispute Petitioner’s description of a person of ordinary skill in the art at this stage of the proceeding. Prelim. Resp. 6–7. Petitioner’s description of a person of ordinary skill appears to be consistent with the subject matter of the ’830 patent. This is supported by the testimony of Petitioner’s declarant, Dr. Polish. See Ex. 1002 ¶ 46. We, therefore, adopt Petitioner’s assessment of a person of ordinary skill for purposes of this Decision. D. Claim Construction” slip op. at 17
Claim construction§ 103 obviousnessDiscretionary denialcites Phillips · KSR · GrahamPatents in suitUS 8,994,830 - PTAB · Mar 13, 2024 · IPR2023-01293 · APJ Michael J Fitzpatrick · IPR · Institution
The Board instituted review of claims 1–14 on both § 103 grounds, finding a reasonable likelihood that Petitioner would prevail on at least one challenged claim.
RulingsInstitution decision- PTAB / AIA Trials › Institution threshold (reasonable likelihood / more likely than not)InstitutedInstituted
“Institution of an inter partes review requires “a reasonable likelihood that the petitioner would prevail with respect to at least 1 of the claims challenged in the petition.” 35 U.S.C. § 314(a). Determining whether a reasonable likelihood has been met has been delegated to the Board. See 37 C.F.R. § 42.4(a) (“The Board institutes the trial on behalf of the Director.”). Upon consideration of the Petition, Preliminary Response, Preliminary Reply, and Preliminary Sur-reply, and for the reasons explained below, we determine that the information presented shows a reasonable likelihood that Petitioner would prevail with respect to at least one claim. Accordingly, we grant the Petition.” slip op. at 2
- PTAB / AIA Trials › Discretionary denial › Fintiv (parallel litigation)Denied
“Patent Owner argues that we should exercise our discretion under 35 U.S.C. § 314(a) and deny the Petition in view of the related lawsuit in the Eastern District of Texas. Prelim. Resp. 26 (citing Apple Inc. v. Fintiv, Inc., No. IPR2020-00019, Paper 11 at 5–6 (PTAB Mar. 20, 2020) (precedential) (“Fintiv”); Interim Procedure for Discretionary Denials in AIA Post-Grant Proceedings with Parallel District Court Litigation (June 21, 2022) (“Interim Procedure”)). However, Petitioner has since filed a Sotera stipulation, so named based on Sotera Wireless, Inc. v. Masimo Corp., IPR2020-01019, Paper 12 (PTAB Dec. 1, 2020) (precedential as to § II.A). See Ex. 1039. Thus, pursuant to the Interim Procedure, we will not discretionarily deny the Petition based on the related lawsuit. See Interim Procedure at 3 (“Consistent with Sotera Wireless, Inc., the PTAB will not discretionarily deny institution in view of parallel district court litigation where a petitioner presents a stipulation not to pursue in a parallel proceeding the same grounds or any grounds that could have reasonably been raised before the PTAB.”).” slip op. at 6
- Skill levelSkill level petitioner adoptedDecided for petitioner
“would have had at least a bachelor’s degree in computer science, electrical engineering, or a similar field, and would have had approximately three years industry experience in networking or communication systems, in particular addressing interoperability between different types of networks and satellite communications. Ex[1002], ¶52. Additional education in the fields of electrical engineering or computer science may serve as a substitute for experience in the field. Id. A person with less or different education but more relevant practical experience, or vice versa, may also meet this standard. Pet. 10. Patent Owner does not dispute Petitioner’s description of a person of ordinary skill in the art or provide its own description. Indeed, Patent Owner witness Michael Crane explicitly “accept[s]” it. Ex. 2001 ¶28. Because Petitioner’s formulation of the level of ordinary skill in the art appears consistent with the ’134 patent and the asserted prior art, and because there is no argument to the contrary at this stage of the proceeding, we apply it in our analysis below.” slip op. at 8
- Claim Construction › Threshold & procedure › Whether a term needs construction (O2 Micro)No construction neededDecided for patent owner
“Petitioner construes two terms that are not actually recited in the claim. First, Petitioner states that “[m]ulticast” means “the delivery of information to a group of destinations simultaneously using the most efficient strategy.” Pet. 11 (citing Ex. 1001: 1:14–16). None of the challenged claims recite “multicast,” but each of the independent claims recite “multicasting.” This decision does not turn on the meaning of “multicasting,” as Patent Owner does not contest that the cited art teaches such a feature. Accordingly, we need not and do not construe explicitly “multicasting.”” slip op. at 9
Claim construction§ 103 obviousnessDiscretionary denialcites KSRPatents in suitUS 8,489,134 - Western Digital Technologies, Inc. v. Longitude Licensing Ltd.Institution deniedPTAB · Jan 8, 2024 · IPR2023-01123 · APJ David C Mckone · IPR · Institution
Institution was denied for claims 1–4 because Petitioner did not show a reasonable likelihood of prevailing on either asserted obviousness ground.
RulingsInstitution decision- PTAB / AIA Trials › Institution threshold (reasonable likelihood / more likely than not)Institution denied meritsDenied
“review. See 35 U.S.C. § 314 (2016); 37 C.F.R. § 42.4(a) (2019). The standard for instituting an inter partes review is set forth in 35 U.S.C. § 314(a), which provides that an inter partes review may not be instituted “unless . . . there is a reasonable likelihood that the petitioner would prevail with respect to at least 1 of the claims challenged in the petition.” For the reasons explained below, we decline to institute an inter partes review of the ’233 patent.” slip op. at 2
- Skill levelSkill level petitioner adoptedDecided for petitioner
“but more experience, or more formal education but less experience, could have also met the relevant standard for” a person of ordinary skill. Pet. 9 (citing Ex. 1003 ¶ 17). Patent Owner does not challenge Petitioner’s proposal. Prelim. Resp. 6. For purposes of this Decision, we adopt Petitioner’s proposal, which we find consistent with the level of skill reflected by the prior art, and which is supported by expert testimony. See Okajima v. Bourdeau, 261 F.3d 1350, 1355 (Fed. Cir. 2001) (the prior art may reflect an appropriate level of skill in the art).” slip op. at 8
- Claim Construction › Intrinsic evidence (Phillips canons) › Lexicography (patentee as own lexicographer)Term construed patent owner constructionDecided for patent owner
“Specifically, the Specification of the ’233 patent states: In this manner, the silicon pillars 5 do not necessarily surround the contact plug 31 in ′-shape and it is satisfactory if the silicon pillars 5 are uniformly arranged with respect to the metal contact plug 31, i.e. the maximum interval between the metal contact plug 31 and the silicon pillar 5 is twice or less the minimum interval between the metal contact plug 31 and the silicon pillar 5.” slip op. at 9
- Obviousness (§103) › Motivation to combine / reasonable expectation of successNot shown unpatentableMotivation not foundNot shown unpatentable
“Endoh and Hwang rests on Endoh’s expression of a need to connect common source diffused layer 9 to a common source line above the top of the semiconductor pillars, and because Petitioner has presented no such evidence of a need in Endoh, Petitioner provides no reason to combine Endoh and Hwang to arrive at claim limitation 1.5. Id. at 17–18. We agree with Patent Owner. Endoh does not appear to teach a position of a common source line CSL and, thus, does not express a need for a means, such as a vertical contact plug, to connect common source diffused layer 9 to a common source line CSL above the top of pillar-shaped silicon layer 2. Dr. Lee’s testimony largely repeats the arguments in the Petition and, thus, does not provide any additional persuasive evidence from which we might conclude that Endoh’s device has a common source line CSL above pillar-shaped silicon layer 2, or any evidence that placement of a common source line CSL above pillar-shaped silicon layer 2 would have been obvious. See Ex. 1003 ¶¶ 66–68, 97–100, 103–105. Thus, we are not persuaded that” slip op. at 23
Claim construction§ 103 obviousnesscites KSR · GrahamPatents in suitUS 9,379,233 - Samsung Electronics Co., Ltd. / Micron Technology, Inc. et al. v. Netlist, Inc.All claims unpatentablePTAB · Dec 5, 2023 · IPR2023-00405 · APJ Jon M Jurgovan · IPR · Final written decision
Claims 1–30 are unpatentable as obvious over Harris, the FBDIMM Standards, and Amidi; the Board did not reach the Spiers grounds.
RulingsFinal written decision- Expert testimonyPetitioner expert creditedOther
“the combination of Harris and FBDIMM Standards and relies on the Declaration of Dr. Andrew Wolfe (Ex. 1003) in support. Pet. 14–40. For the reasons that follow, we are persuaded that the evidence, including Dr. Wolfe’s testimony, supports Petitioner’s showing and establishes by a preponderance of the evidence that these claims are unpatentable.” slip op. at 17
- Skill levelSkill level petitioner adoptedDecided for petitioner
“Petitioner asserts a person of ordinary skill in the art “would have had an advanced degree in electrical or computer engineering, or a related field, and two years working or studying in the field of design or development of memory systems, or a bachelor’s degree in such engineering disciplines and at least three years working in the field.” Pet. 7–8 (citing Ex. 1003 ¶ 61). Petitioner contends that additional training can substitute for educational or research experience, and vice versa. Id. at 8. Petitioner asserts that such a hypothetical person would have been familiar with the JEDEC industry standards, and knowledgeable about the design and operation of standardized DRAM and SDRAM memory devices and memory modules and how they interacted with a memory controller and other parts of a computer system, including standard communication busses and protocols, such as PCI and SMBus busses and protocols. Id. Petitioner further contends that such “a hypothetical person would also have been familiar with the structure and operation of circuitry used to access and control computer memories, including sophisticated circuits such as ASICs, FPGAs, and CPLDs, and more low-level circuits such as tri-state buffers.” Id. Petitioner further asserts that such “a hypothetical person would further have been familiar with voltage supply requirements of such structures (e.g., memory modules, memory devices, memory controller, and associated access and control circuitry), including voltage conversion and voltage regulation circuitry.” Id. Patent Owner indicates “[f]or the purposes of this [Response], Patent Owner is applying the level of ordinary skill in the art proposed by Petitioner.” Resp. 2. The evidence that Petitioner presents mostly applies to the educational level and experience of workers in the field, but also touches upon other factors as well, including problems and solutions in the prior art and complexity of the technology. See Pet. 7–8. We find Petitioner’s proposal is consistent with the level of skill in the art reflected by the ’054 patent and the prior art of record, and, therefore, we adopt Petitioner’s proposed level of ordinary skill in the art, with the exception of the open-ended language “at least,” which introduces ambiguity and may encompass skill levels beyond ordinary.” slip op. at 11
- Claim Construction › Intrinsic evidence (Phillips canons) › Preamble limiting or notPreamble limitingDecided for patent owner
“The District Court’s Claim Construction Order (Ex. 2032) issued after our Institution Decision (Paper 11). Although Petitioner argued in the District Court litigation that the claim preambles were not limiting, Petitioner does not appear to maintain that argument here following the District Court’s determination that the preambles are limiting. Ex. 2032, 35. Since the term is recited in both the preambles and bodies of these claims, there is evidence that the inventors of the ’054 patent intended the term to limit the claim, as the District Court determined. See Catalina Mktg. Int’l., Inc. v. Coolsavings,com, Inc., 289 F.3d 801, 808 (Fed. Cir. 2002) (citing Bell Commc’ns Rsch., Inc. v. Vitalink Communications Corp., 55 F.3d 615, 620 (Fed. Cir. 1995) (“dependence on a particular disputed preamble phrase for antecedent basis may limit claim scope because it indicates a reliance on both the preamble and claim body to define the claimed invention.”)).” slip op. at 16
- Claim Construction › Intrinsic evidence (Phillips canons) › Plain and ordinary meaning to a POSITATerm construed board ownDecided for patent owner
“We agree with Petitioner’s contention that “memory module” is not limited to “main memory modules . . . designed to connect to the primary memory controller.” See Reply 2. The ’054 patent states In certain embodiments, the device contains a high density Flash memory with a low density DRAM, wherein the DRAM is used as a data buffer for read/write operation. The Flash serves as the main memory. Ex. 1001, 11:3–6 (emphases added). This is the only mention of “main memory” in the ’054 patent. That the Flash memory serves as “main memory” in “certain embodiments” implies that there may be other embodiments in which this is not the case. Accordingly, we agree with Petitioner that the term “memory module” is not limited to “main memory modules . . . designed to connect to the primary memory controller.” We agree with Patent Owner that the “memory module” includes structure to connect with a “host system” including its memory controller. See, e.g., Ex. 1001, code (57), 12:52–59. The claims do not mention a “memory controller,” but they do mention that the “memory module” has an “interface” to connect with a “host system.” Ex. 1001, 38:20–25 (claim 1), 39:63–65 (claim 16), 41:6–8 (claim 24). That the “memory module” has structure for connecting to the host system’s memory controller may thus be implied from the claims. We agree with Petitioner that the District Court’s determination was that the preambles (presumably of claims 1, 4, 6, 11, 16 and 25) are limiting. Ex. 2032, 35. To the extent that the District Court’s determination construed “memory module” to include structure necessary to connect to a memory controller, our construction of “memory module” is consistent.” slip op. at 16
Patent outcomesUS 11,232,054 unpatentableClaim construction§ 103 obviousnesscites Phillips · KSR · GrahamPatents in suitUS 11,232,054 - Universal Electronics, Inc. / Gemstar Technology (Qinzhou) Co. Ltd. et al. v. ROKU, Inc.Some claims unpatentablePTAB · Oct 23, 2023 · IPR2022-00818 · APJ Patrick M Boucher · IPR · Final written decision
Claims 1–5, 8–10, and 14 are unpatentable over RadioShack; claim 11 was not shown unpatentable over Wouters and Verzulli because the combination did not disclose the claimed combining and installing steps.
RulingsFinal written decision- Novelty / Anticipation (§102) › Prior-art status of a reference › Printed publication / public accessibilityPrinted publication establishedDecided for petitioner
“disseminated to the interested public, ‘public accessibility’ has been called the touch-stone in determining whether a reference constitutes a ‘printed publication’ . . . .” Jazz Pharm., Inc. v. Amneal Pharm., LLC, 895 F.3d 1347, 1356 (Fed. Cir. 2018) (quoting In re Hall, 781 F.2d 897, 898–99 (Fed. Cir. 1986)). A reference is considered “publicly accessible” if it was “disseminated or otherwise made available to the extent that persons interested and ordinarily skilled in the subject matter or art, exercising reasonable diligence, can locate it.” Id. at 1355–56 (citing In re Wyer, 655 F.2d 221, 226 (CCPA 1981)). Petitioner treats this requirement as having two aspects, namely (1) whether a person of ordinary skill could reasonably have found RemoteCentral.com and (2) whether such a skilled artisan could reasonably have found RadioShack on RemoteCentral.com. Reply 8–13; see also Tr. 33:25–34:8 (Patent Owner asserting that there are two aspects to the analysis on public accessibility: “The first is whether a [person of ordinary skill in the art] would have known to arrive at the website containing the prior art reference. The second one is . . . , [a]ssuming the [person of ordinary skill in the art] would have done so, would the [person of ordinary skill in the art], exercising reasonable diligence, have located the prior art reference on the site? And these are separate and distinct requirements, and if you fail one of them, the document is not publicly accessible.”).” slip op. at 27
- Strike new argumentNew argument consideredDecided for petitioner
“addressed squarely by the principles set forth in Hulu, which addresses the standards at the institution stage and during the trial for evaluating evidence proffered to show asserted art qualifies as a printed publication. Specifically, after a petitioner has presented “evidence sufficient to establish a reasonable likelihood that the reference was publicly accessible before the critical date of the challenged patent,” such that trial is instituted, “some limited opportunities exist for the petitioner to present new evidence later.” Hulu at 13–14. These “limited opportunities” include “in a reply to the patent owner response,” provided that the additional evidence is “responsive to the prior briefing” and provided that the additional evidence does not require “completely reopen[ing] the record, by, for example, changing theories after filing a petition.” Id. at 14–15. Although Patent Owner contends that “[t]his is not an example of permissible rebuttal evidence, but rather a belated attempt to fill a gap in the evidence in the Petition,” we disagree. See Sur-reply 6. Rather, the 7 Patent Owner appears to refer incorrectly to Exhibit 1040 instead of Exhibit 1041 when identifying “articles allegedly referring to RemoteCentral.com.” See Sur-reply 5–6. progression within the instant proceeding comports well with the Hulu framework. During the preliminary proceeding, Petitioner came forth with “evidence sufficient to establish a reasonable likelihood that [RadioShack] was publicly accessible before the critical date of the challenged patent,” just as Hulu demands. Hulu at 13; Inst. Dec. 23 (“[W]e determine that Petitioner’s showing regarding public accessibility of RadioShack is sufficient under the standard we apply at this stage of the proceeding.”). Patent Owner challenges RadioShack’s status as a printed publication in its Response, just as Hulu contemplates. Hulu at 15; PO Resp. 28–41. And Petitioner submits additional evidence that replies to that challenge without changing its theory that RadioShack qualifies as a printed publication by virtue of its accessibility on the RemoteCentral.com web site and in light of date indicia on RadioShack itself.8 See Hulu at 15–16; Reply 7–13. Moreover, in determining that Petitioner’s additional evidence directed at RemoteCentral.com is properly considered, we are further mindful of the Federal Circuit’s endorsement that “the petitioner in an inter partes review proceeding may introduce new evidence after the petition stage if the evidence is a legitimate reply to evidence introduced by the patent owner.” Anacor Pharm., Inc. v. Iancu, 889 F.3d 1372, 1830–81 (Fed. 8 In its Reply, Petitioner also relies on evidence of publication of RadioShack on Radio Shack’s own public website and on “a third location,” hifi-remote.com. Reply 14. As we discuss below, we determine that the presence of RadioShack on RemoteCentral.com is sufficient to qualify RadioShack as a printed publication. We therefore do not reach the issue of whether presence on either the Radio Shack web site or on hifi-remote.com is an improper new theory raised by Petitioner in its Reply. See Tr. 8:13– 9:23 (Petitioner discussing whether reliance on hifi-remote.com presents a different theory than set forth in the Petition). Cir. 2018); see also Vidstream LLC v. Twitter, Inc., 981 F.3d 1060, 1065 (Fed. Cir. 2020) (“The Board denied VidStream’s Motion to Exclude, holding that it was appropriate to permit Twitter to respond to VidStream’s challenge [to the status of Bradford as a printed publication] by providing additional evidence to establish the Bradford publication date. We conclude that the Board acted appropriately, for the Board permitted both sides to provide evidence concerning the reference date of the Bradford book, in pursuit of the correct answer.”). We accordingly give due weight to Petitioner’s additional evidence of RadioShack’s accessibility on the RemoteCentral.com web site.” slip op. at 25
- ExcludeMotion to exclude, deniedDenied
“1 Patent Owner objected to Petitioner’s demonstrative slides 45 and 68 as presenting a new argument that was not previously made with respect to challenged claims 2 and 10. Paper 27; see Paper 26 (Petitioner’s demonstratives), 45, 68. At the oral hearing, we reserved ruling on the objections. Tr. 5:23–6:3. Both slides reproduce the same portions of Exhibits 1002 and 1025, with the statement that “A press and hold for an auto-scan or brand-scan is admitted prior art.” Paper 26, 45, 68. As explained below, we do not reach the predicate position upon which the objections are based. See Tr. 5:8–11 (Petitioner stating that “this Board only needs to resolve this objection if it accepts Roku’s claim construction argument that the claims cover a press and hold of a single button, but that they do not cover pressing multiple buttons to present that argument in the alternative. So, if you reject that argument, you don’t even have to resolve the objection.”). We accordingly dismiss the objections as moot.” slip op. at 2
- Skill levelSkill level patent owner adoptedDecided for patent owner
“We agree with this assessment, and the parties do not specifically advocate for one articulation over the other in this proceeding. See Pet. 8 (Petitioner asserting that “[t]he Challenged Claims are unpatentable under both proposed levels”); PO Resp. 5 (Patent Owner stating its “position that the challenged claims are unpatentable under either proposed level of ordinary skill”). We adopt Patent Owner’s proposed statement of the level of ordinary skill as advanced in the related ITC Investigation. But we note that we would reach the same ultimate conclusion that Petitioner shows, by a preponderance of the evidence, that all challenged claims are unpatentable were we to adopt Petitioner’s proposal instead.” slip op. at 12
Patent outcomesUS 8,378,875 mixedClaim construction§ 102 anticipation§ 103 obviousnesscites Phillips · KSR · GrahamPatents in suitUS 8,378,875
Holdings, summaries, rulings, issues, outcomes, winners and claim constructions shown for a decision were generated by a large language model reading the opinion. They are a guide to the decision, not the decision. Confirm every one against the court's own text before relying on it. Outcomes read from the patent owner’s side. Party names are extracted from the decision and are missing on about 900 short Director denials and scans, which carry the trial number instead.